Photography Thailand Forum

[Loso]

Hi Everyone,

New to the forum.  I would like to get your opinion on a good dslr/lens combination that produces very sharp images for an upcoming trip to Thailand.  The type of shooting will be general touristy things, such as street vendors, temples, indoor shooting without a flash, etc.  My preference is to travel light, so I'd like to only take one camera body and one all-purpose lens. 

I have yet to make a purchase, but am eyeing the Canon 5D/24-105mm kit.  Is the 24-105 f/4 IS sharp and fast enough for indoor shooting without a flash?  Or is the 24-70 f/2.8 a better option?    Which one produces sharper images?  I'm aware that the 24-105 has an image stabilizer and is lighter, but that the 24-70 is faster.  Since I intend to shoot a fair amount indoors, would the 24-70 be the way to go? 

A new 5D/24-105 kit is available here in the U.S. for $2,750.  Buying the body and lens separately costs about $350-$400 more, so the kit is a good deal.  Wish there was an option for a 5D/24-70 kit.

[David Salmanowitz]

From all I have read in assorted online discussions, the 24-70 is sharper at the edges than the 24-105. That is pretty much always the case with extended range zooms, you give up something to get something. That said I have a friend who has the 24-105 and likes it. I do not, but I do have the 24-70 and a 5D and it is sharp--not as sharp as some Canon primes but it is a fine lens.

[Chris Savery]

Ok, here's my opinion, which some will disagree with. You say you want to travel light. Assuming you are NOT shooting for travel stock sales or feel you need to have the absolute highest quality for fine art prints then I would go one of two ways - either one of the fairly compact Pentax or Fuji new models with it's standard lens or the Canon G9 compact model. In particular the G9 will get you away from a large heavy traveling companion that you need to baby every step while here. I've carried my 20D and 24-70 (and 70-200) all over Thailand and it's my honest opinion now that the size and weight are both minuses to enjoying it and getting great shots. I'm saying this from the point of view that max pixels and sharpness are not really what makes the best photo. The 24-70 is a fine lens but for the weight so are the Tamron equivalents and they're much nicer to carry in the heat.

Having wandered through markets with the 24-70 held up and shooting I can tell you that it's impossible to go unnoticed and people quickly assume that your'e shooting for publication and often turn away. (Have you seen the 24-70 held up in a crowd with it's lens hood on?) I've had the opposite experience with small cameras because people likewise quickly assume it's just another tourist. Even though nowadays the tourist DSLR saturation rate is very high here. Really, when I go down to the park nearby I can  guessimate that the camera-holder rate is well over 50% now. What I mean is by watching people while just walking around the number holding a camera in plain view as they walk is over 50% and many of those are DLSR models. What I'm saying is that everyone has jumped on to this bangwagon now and unless your'e working as a journalist or shooting professionally you will most likely get better shots by being less conspicuous. A nice old rangefinder for street shots would be cool but I think the G9 comes close.

And there. My opinion for everyone to start slamming.

[Gus]

Opinions are what makes this forum valuable Chris. 

[epixx]

I agree with Chris entirely. A small DSLR with a good, compact zoom is an ideal solution. Olympus E-510 with the excellent 14-42mm f/3.5-5.6 and in-body IS costs around THB 26,000 (around USD 750). Add the new 70-300 zoom, and we are talking 40,000. Other alternatives are Pentax K100D (also in-body IS), Nikon D40 or D40X or Canon 400D.

My own travel camera in this region is the Olympus E-1, with the 11-22mm f/2.8-3.5 (22-44mm eqv.) and an old, manual focus OM-Zuiko 100mm f/2.8. Do I miss the weight of a bigger camera and some heavy lenses? No. Am I happy that I can go more or less unnoticed around in local market with 200mm reach when people think I have a p&s camera. Yes, thank you, very big   

Small, light is usually better than big heavy, particularly when travelling. A G9 (or a Nikon P5100) are alternatives as well, but personally, I see a small DSLR as a perfect compromise.

Oh, and btw., a Pentax K10D (and the  corresponding Samsung model) can be had for next to nothing now, since the K20D is right around the corner. THB 26,000 or thereabout is the going rate, including weather sealing and in-body IS. Add a couple of the beautiful, compact, high quality Pentax "Limited" primes (available in 21, 31, 40, 43, 70 and 77mm) at around 20,000 a piece, and you have the most wonderful travel kit. The camera is a bit bigger then the above mentioned (around the size of a 40D), but the viewfinder is closer to a 5D, and it feels like it's built out of pure granite.

[David Salmanowitz]

Chris, Epixx, ...I agree on a lot of points, bigger is not always better and the older I get the heavier the camera gear seems. As far as the G9 I fooled around a tiny bit with my nephew's g/f's G9 at Christmas, the camera, not her.    I was amazed and thought it to be very nice, some features were really cool. I also remember saying that it would be a lot nicer carrying it around all day than my SLR with a big heavy lens. Just saw this, and as you know many people love the G9. Leica is sure to be not too happy at what is written in this link. I know some folks who use the G9 in a housing underwater, but there I still prefer the SLR and multiple strobes.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/G9-Japan.shtml

[BorisD]

Get a Nikon D40x or a used Nikon D80, both offer 10MP, so you can crop around, they are small, inexpensive and it does hurt too much if they get stolen or damaged. Together with Nikon 18-200mm VR lens, used for about 600 USD, it should cover whatever your need is. If you want cheaper you can get one of those Sigma 18-200 mm, but there quality issues. If you need wide, get the Nikon 12-24mm with it and you are really covered.

[kinginexile]

Chris, you make a good point, but i'd say to Loso to read about the pros and cons of the G9. For being a cool all-around camera, there might be some limitations and features that make it undesirable to him.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canong9/page20.asp

Not sure how Loso, you are into the DSLR use. 5D might be an extra-reach, I don't know. I would tend to go with the "go light" crowd. 400D (or 450D if traveling after April, by them you may get your hands on it) and 2 top lenses. The 400D retails reasonably now (500 and some$ in US), that leaves you with 2200 to spend on glass, and you know what we all say about glass. that's where it's at. f/4 will not help you much inside, even at 1600 ISO with IS. Have either  a good low-light prime, or at least a zoom with fixed f/2.8. I' d advise for a 17-55mm IS f/2.8  and give a good thinking between the 24-105 and 70-200 f/4 IS, an apparently stellar zoom. For the 15mm lacking between 55 and 70, you can walk a bit ;-).    

[Bryan Bondurant]

  These threads are always fun, its a virtual neverending question with no correct answer that boils down and render's to use what you got. Just when I was very happy with my camera setup I became very unhappy with film and Im hoping to get a digital body for my favorite 50mm M mount lens if I can get one for under 2,000 US. If thats not possible I will most likely get a Nikon Digital Body and a Zeiss 50mm 2.0 lens so I can still get fantastic lowlight no flash photography. I for whatever reason dislike telephoto lenses, if your working with flash it should not matter about your lens speed but for me it does.

  There will be more cameras released everyday this week to watch for but I would have to say, stick with Nikon or Canon in Thailand, one lens, one body, multiple cards, 2 extra credit cards in case you need new gear quickly, some kind of digital storage account where you can upload and archive all your images as often as possible, and a couple portable hard drives.

  I have wasted years messing around with all kinds of set ups and lenses, I finally just ended up using a 50mm lens and if I would have kept my old Nikon 50mm 1.4 lens all these years I would have saved plenty of money and not missed so many good pictures.

[epixx]

I have wasted years messing around with all kinds of set ups and lenses, I finally just ended up using a 50mm lens and if I would have kept my old Nikon 50mm 1.4 lens all these years I would have saved plenty of money and not missed so many good pictures.

For travel and hobby photography, I agree. A couple of weeks ago, I spent three days in Hanoi, bringing an Olympus E-1 and three lenses. The first day, the adapter that I used for an old, manual focus OM-Zuiko 100mm f/2.8 (200mm eqv. on the E-1) got stuck to the camera, so I could only use that single lens. Did it limit my photography? Not at all. I came back here with around 500 photos, mostly street portraits. Here's one:



The best travel cameras in my view are the DSLR's from Pentax and Olympus. They are relatively compact, weather sealed, and most of them have in-body IS. Olympus would be my choice for zooms, like the 11-22mm f/2.8-3.5 or the new 12-60mm f/2.8-4.0, and the Pentax cameras (K10D is less than 30,000 baht now), with a couple of their excellent "Limited" lenses. Some of those lenses weigh just over 100g, although they are all metal, and will fit in a jeans pocket.

[kinginexile]

Brian, remember that 50mm on a digital Nikon body is 75mm.  Someday, I will switch to prime, for now I do enjoy the versatility of zooms, still in the boys category, not quite the men, I guess, for photography. But going back to the OP, maybe an all-around zoom (17-50/5 or 24-105), plus 2 low-light primes, is all you (I?) need. the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 (or 28mm f/2.8 for 5D) will take care of inside shots, and nightlife flashless shots, and the cheap but fine 100mm f/2 will be there for close-up interior portraits, and all types of evening shows/performances.

[Bryan Bondurant]

Brian, remember that 50mm on a digital Nikon body is 75mm.  Someday, I will switch to prime, for now I do enjoy the versatility of zooms, still in the boys category, not quite the men, I guess, for photography. But going back to the OP, maybe an all-around zoom (17-50/5 or 24-105), plus 2 low-light primes, is all you (I?) need. the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 (or 28mm f/2.8 for 5D) will take care of inside shots, and nightlife flashless shots, and the cheap but fine 100mm f/2 will be there for close-up interior portraits, and all types of evening shows/performances.

  I have never even used a digital SLR, from what I understand the digital rangefinders like the M8 use a full size sensor so it does not change the lens view like the small censer DSLR bodies, For sure I will have all my numbers correct before I lay out any cash.

[epixx]

The only two available digital rangefinders use a 1.3 crop (Leica M8) and a 1.6 crop (Epson RD1) sensor. Rumour is that Leica works on a full frame sensor for the next model, but there are special challenges with rangefinders, particularly when using wide lenses, since the sensor sits much closer to the lens than in a DSLR. All wide-angle lenses on the M8 creates a certain degree of vignetting, which is corrected by camera firmware, if the new generation coded Leica lenses are used.

[Bryan Bondurant]

The only two available digital rangefinders use a 1.3 crop (Leica M8) and a 1.6 crop (Epson RD1) sensor. Rumour is that Leica works on a full frame sensor for the next model, but there are special challenges with rangefinders, particularly when using wide lenses, since the sensor sits much closer to the lens than in a DSLR. All wide-angle lenses on the M8 creates a certain degree of vignetting, which is corrected by camera firmware, if the new generation coded Leica lenses are used.

Ive been watching this down to the minute, Leica is supposed to announce some kind of deal where you can send your M8 back and get the hardware upgraded, I'm not to impressed with that at all. Many of us are dreaming up a Zeiss Cosina Digital M collaboration but it may be just a fantasy. One good thing is it appears that Sigma will finally release the much anticipated and one year late DP1 which is also considerable for me.